Episode 28 - What to Do Before You Decide on Your Next Career Move

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Welcome to the Women's Career Mastery Podcast, the show that's dedicated to empowering women to redefine success and break through barriers. I'm your host, Christine, and my co-host, Laura, along with our amazing guests and experts. We are here to shatter the myths that has been hindering women's careers.

Women's career fulfillment for far too long. So, if you're ready to master your career and take your life to the next level, join us in our journey together. The Women's Career Mastery podcast starts now.

Hello listeners. Have you ever found yourself questioning your career path with thoughts? Like, is this really? If so, you are not alone. Many people are experiencing this right now.

In today's episode, our guests shared valuable insights on navigating this crossroads with clarity. Whether  you're feeling stuck, considering a bold move, or just exploring your career options. This episode is packed with essential advice.  We'll dive into the preparations questions and considerations needed to navigate your career  transition.

So, grab your favorite note, taking app or good old pen and paper, and let's redefine career success. That is just for you. Trust me, your future self will thank you for tuning in today.

All right. Without further ado, I hand it over to my cohost, Laura.

Hello, listeners. It's great to be back for another episode of the Women's Career Mastery podcast. Our guest is Charlene Ridley. Charlene is the visionary behind the Unpause Your Dreams brand, which encompasses a group coaching program, retreats, a brainstorming journal, and a brand new 2000 square foot content studio for women in the Charlotte North Carolina area, which is where She is based as a multi passionate creative and serial entrepreneur.

Charlene shines as a podcast host, speaker, and coach with a background in education and two decades of corporate leadership experience. She brings a wealth of knowledge and insight to her work and offers a treasure trove of ideas and guidance to help individuals gain clarity, build courage, and confidently turn their someday dreams into reality.

Charlene is also a dedicated mom of three and the proud owner of a French Bulldog poodle, her vibrant energy and exceptional ability to articulate the challenges women face in their careers and lives and how to make their dreams a reality, make her an invaluable guest for us on our podcast. So, let's jump in and get started.

Charlene, we're super excited to have you join us on the podcast. Perhaps you could share why you wanted to join us today.

Thank you. First of all, Laura and Christine for having me. I'm so excited to be here and really excited about our conversation. So, I love what you guys are doing and the conversations that you are having around careers.

I find that there. So many people that are mid-career or sort of later career that are having thoughts about what's next and they don't really know what they should consider. And I think this is a perfect platform and audience to talk through that and to give them some ideas and tools to help them either transition to the next thing in life, whether it's another role or career, or if it's something else that lights them up even more.

Thank you, Charlene.

We talked before and, she proposed this idea, and we think that is what most people or most women in their career are thinking right now. And that's related to also, Where I was before I left my corporate career. And so, Charlene, what do you hear these days about what women thinking, maybe from your clients, I know there is that fear or questions that we always ask ourselves, especially when, there's a lot of challenges at work, people are leaving or get laid off and you start thinking, what do you hear so far?

Yeah. That's a really good question. And what I'm realizing from people that are still in the workforce and are in these situations where work is just not what they thought it was going to be right. Like, I know that in our discussions that we had before this podcast, we talked about what our ideas are for careers and for life in our 20s.

And then by the time we're in our 40s, it can look very different, and it may no longer be aligned with us. And so, lots of people are asking the question of what do I want? Right? Like, especially coming off of the pandemic, what is it that I want, not only in the role that I'm doing, but the organization that I'm working in, the people that I'm working with, what, what is it that I want and how do I align my life so that I am doing things that are more of what I want instead of just committing to and staying committed to things that used to be what I wanted.

And I think that's a really good question to ask. So, when, when I have clients that are asking that, I always give them like three things to start with. I think the first thing is to reflect on your values and your passions, right? Identify what are your core values? At this moment in your life, not what were they 10 years ago or when you started this role?

What are they now? And does your current role align with that? Are you, are you able to realize those values in that, in that role? And what is your passion? Are you connected to that passion either through the work that you're doing professionally or through the hobbies that you have in the community and in your greater life?

So, I think that's the first question that I have people ask, and I have two others that I helped them through as well, but I want to go ahead and give you a chance because it looks like maybe you have another question or thought about that so far.

Yeah, thank you for that. I think that's a very good question to ask, to reflect, and this has come with the ideas of we sometimes don't think that we are an evolving being, like you want to go to your career in the 20s, you have an idea what success means to you.

And then, you have family or things change, you become a different person. So, the first time you get into your career, you go through it. And now, even maybe in five years or 10 years, we all are a different person. And the one that you said about, what do I want? And I think that's, that's a very valid question to ask, not just when you're thinking about moving or doing something else, but every few years maybe, every year to ask, what do I really want?

Because we change. We all change, with all, our experience and what we want and what we want to contribute changing all the time.

That is so true. And I agree with you. It is something that you shouldn't be asking just when it's time to switch careers or look at a new promotion. It's something that you should be checking in with yourself.

I would almost say they're like, dare to say every few months because life is so incredibly busy, and we get on the path of being productive and going in one direction. And oftentimes we'll be in that work and realize this is not what I thought it was. And it's not exciting me, but we will continue because we've committed and I think it's important that we honor our commitments, but I also think it's important that we honor ourselves and the facts that we are ever evolving to consistently check in and say, okay, what do I want?

Because if I've committed, let's say I'm in a role and I've committed to a long-term project, I can check in with myself at six months and say, Okay, what do I want? Do I want more of this work? Right? I'm committed for X period of time. But do I want to continue to pursue work like this outside? Am I positioning myself as a thought leader outside of work in this area?

Or is there something else that lights me up that I could be doing on the side and gaining new skills and in that sort of way?

I was just going to jump in and say, sometimes We forget that we can think like that, Charlene, like there are times that you get so caught up in your career and following the career path that maybe the company has outlined for your specific profession, right?

You're a software developer and you're growing in that field and you're moving up and maybe you even move into management. You sort of get caught on that track. And. I'm just wondering, like, how do you manage that with also thinking about what it is you really want? Is it where you get to choose maybe what projects you want to work on or, what clients you might be best working with?

Like, how can someone work while they're on that track, but also focusing on what they might want for themselves?

Well, that's a really good question. And I think it's incredible that if we're asking ourselves what we want, that we can better advocate for ourselves in our current roles.

And we really can ask for work that aligns with what lights us up, because sometimes we're using your example of the software engineer track, if we're on that track and what if we realize like, oh, this isn't what I thought it would be. And, you know, but I've invested a lot of time and money in education in becoming.

And so when we're talking about evaluating this person and having this role, oftentimes the first idea is, okay, I need to transition completely and I need to go into another industry, but that may not be it. Like the second thing that I always recommend is evaluating your skills and strengths and understanding your current skill set and what you really enjoy.

So, it would be sitting down and looking at that role and saying, okay, based on what I'm doing right now, what do I want? What do I want more of? What clients do I really enjoy working with? What skill sets do I really enjoy, you know, engaging in and those sorts of things. And how can I align my career path in this container, right?

The software engineer container, how can I align that work with what I'm currently doing and then being able to go to your leadership and advocate for yourself? Like I'm really interested. I'm interested in doing more of this work. So please keep me in mind , when you having these new opportunities, I think that's really the goal while you're in your career path and wanting to know, what do you want?

Being attuned to what do you like about the work that you're doing? What do you desire more of? What are your current skill sets and what would you like to improve and grow in that way?

Yeah, I think there's also room for if you can't find it in your current role, like you're asking, you're advocating, it's just not available right now.

You can do a side hustle, right? You can go experiment and see somewhere, maybe a volunteer job. Is it something you really enjoy doing?

Absolutely. And I have a lot of people that say, you know, I don't know if I want to take on side hustling, right?

Like that just seems like a lot of work. And so, you certainly can invest in side hustles and becoming freelance or doing some consulting on the side. But another thing that is really great is maybe it doesn't exist on your team at your company, but you can certainly cross promote yourself to other, teams and say, hey, I have this skill set or this is something I'm learning, looking to learn more about.

Okay. Do you have any, you know, there's a lower level of effort, right? Project that they can pull you into that you can volunteer your time to learn and grow in that way. And also experience like, what does it like to do this work to see if it's something that you would indeed want without having to start an entire side hustle and feel like you're entering into a new level of commitment there.

I love what you both saying because it seems it's not a drastic change. And I think after let's say you've been a career for 10 years 15 years or even five years after a while you get used to it, and to have a drastic change, sometimes it's hard, and this way, it's more about being creative, being curious of what else is here, what kind of opportunity I can use here so that I can grow in where I want, maybe like in 10 years and five years.

So that way it feels safer. It feels like, yeah, I can kind of play because sometimes a lot of people who just left their job and want to start something new, there's so much fear going on and, you know, some of us experienced that here as well, but that is a nicer way or playful way of kind of moving around and finding your way to what you want without losing much kind of, securities.

I agree. And I think that as adults, we learn a lot more and we're more open to learning when the stakes feel lower, like when, when the stakes are high, there's so much invested, and to your point I always say to people, if you're really questioning where you are in your career journey, and you're exploring entrepreneurship as an exit, right, or an escape, Then you need to rethink that, right?

Because entrepreneurship is not an escape from corporate. It is something that you should really feel called to and you should have an exit strategy and plan going into. But I think that when the stakes are lower, like in the example of volunteering your time on another team, right. You get the opportunity to play to experience and to see if it is something that you want to do without making this huge drastic change or trying to escape your current reality.

And then you can make a better and more informed decision of what you really want. Now another question with that, because there are some people that. Probably felt, oh, this is, unbearable, like I don't like my job or I don't like where I am. And having a daydream every day. Exit the situations.

For people who are desperately want to exit, do you have any tips or how to overcome it? Well, I think that if you are desperately wanting to exit, I think the first thing that I have to say is just being very realistic in what your exit plan and strategy is, so, the thing that comes up to me is, you’re going to exit and do what,

If you're going to start your business, then really thinking through like, what does that business look like? Who will I serve? And really approaching it as if it was your corporate job that you're working, because oftentimes people will think, okay, I'm going to go experience entrepreneurship, but then they'll go into it more as a hobbyist.

Right, expecting it to yield the results that it would yield if it was actually being run like a business. So, I think thinking through what is next and creating a plan around it being very clear in your plan. And in that plan, determining like, If I'm going to exit corporate, what's that exit strategy look like?

How am I going to consider things like health insurance, right? Like my retirement, all of the things that are so important after you've invested, time and energy into your career. Think about those things and plan through them and really be realistic. I would say part of your planning is you really need to create conversations with people that are entrepreneurs so you will have a realistic idea of what the work looks like, because it's very different than most people think and it is not an escape.

I can't say that enough because people will say I'm over it. Especially in 2020 when we saw all of these new people launching these new businesses and doing these new things, and it was very exciting and attractive because I think that it has created an option that many of us have not considered.

Maybe we've wanted deep down inside, but we've not been considered because if anyone's like me, I was raised, grow up, go to school, get a good job. Right. And work that job. And now it's like, Oh, entrepreneurship. Is an option. Maybe I should go experience this, but it is definitely jumping into the deep end.

If you don't have a plan and you have not thought through this, really given it some thought and are really committed to what you're doing in a clear about the work that you're doing.

Yeah, in both the, thinking about an exit plan from maybe a corporate job to entrepreneurship, or even just trying to switch teams or switch, positions in the company.

It's going to take some strategic thinking, some work. It's not a quick decision is what I'm hearing.

Yes. It is not a quick decision, and I think what I could say about if you're going to transition into a new career field or even into entrepreneurship, it's not something that you should do when you are at your wits end at work, right?

Like, I will meet with clients that will say, I knew 10 years ago that I needed to leave. And then what happens is because they didn't take any action or make a strategy or plan to exit, then they may get to a place of desperation that they jump into either another role or they take a drastic pay cut, which then causes the uncomfortability of lifestyle change.

Or they will make the drastic jump into entrepreneurship without creating the plan and the foundation to really grow it as a business and not a hobby. And it just leads to discomfort. So, I think understanding and again, going back to our earlier part of the conversation, checking in with yourself, what do you want so that you don't get 10 years in and you're like, I knew I should have left a long time ago.

And you're making desperate, like, rash decisions in the moment, because you just need relief from the work that you're in. I think that's so important.

Right. And I just want to say it's never too late, right? Even if you've been like, we've had long careers in companies. I had 20 years in one company, like, I'm still working on what you said, you know, thinking about what do I value?

What do I want to work on? What's meaningful for me? What am I passionate about? Even more so today than ever, I think. So, asking yourself those types of questions continuously throughout your career, no matter what stage you're in is important.

I think it is important. And I think that one of the third things that I always tell people is to like, really consider your work life balance and your mental health.

Because another thing that I think is important, and we've seen this recently in terms of there are a lot of women in very large, well-known companies that are C suite that are exiting, they're leaving the C suite after all of these years, and I think it's important to know that your dreams change.

You may have been the young woman whose dream was for that, but there's a tremendous amount of weight that that carries. And there's a lot of sacrifice. And when you're looking at work life balance and you're looking at your mental health and you're assessing your stressors and you're understanding personal fulfillment and what drives you, especially, you know, when you're in your 40s and then beyond, it's much different.

Right. And you can make decisions based on that, because it doesn't necessarily mean exiting the core company or corporation altogether. It can be something like I had a client who went from a leadership role to an individual contributor role, because she understood that the demands on her time at the leadership level were something that she was not willing to continue to give.

And at the individual contributor role, it was a lot less demanding, a lot less stressful, and it was more congruent with where she was at that current phase in life. But really understanding that is important to making the best decisions for you. And also knowing that your decisions are going to be different than other people's. Just because it worked for Charlene or maybe for Laura or even Christine doesn't mean it means it's an example for you and what's possible, but you don't have to do it the same way.

That's very interesting because I felt what happened. When we start, what is it for me? Or what do I want? What's my value? There is also a kind of consequence of doing that, which is asking what success means to me. And, I think one of the key things that I learned is, the idea of how can we own our career, how we can own what success means to us, because, like you said, from C suite going back to, it's more like downgrading, I would imagine some people will feel like lowering myself or I feel like failure so it's asking question again, what is success for us?

What is a meaningful fulfillment for ourselves and unlearn what our society tells us about success. That's so true. And it's so funny. And that takes some work, right? It's a process. Because not only are we influenced by what society has told us success is, we are influenced by our family and what our family has told us is successful.

So, when I was leaving Corporate America to go full time and coaching and in my business, my parents were not happy. And you know, I haven't lived at home many decades, but my father said, I don't understand, right? Like you have achieved incredible success. You have this position; you're making more money than anyone in the family ever has.

Why would you leave? And can you support yourself doing this other thing? And so that was really something that I had to work through internally because I knew that I had the desire to exit. I knew that I had a plan. I knew that my plan was a good plan, but one of the things that was important to me was talking it through with my family, and helping them understand that even though this is not the way that you have seen it done, because my parents are in their 80s. You may not have seen this as an experience, or you may not be familiar. This is a viable option, and here's my plan, and this is why it's important to me. And really asking them to support me in changing my dream.

Because I was working for my dream company. And that was incredibly freeing, and that allowed me to make the decision to transition into something else. And I think that's really important that we know that when we're processing, we have to sort of sit with our own ideas of success, but we also have to reconcile what society has told us or what our families have given us and find a way to make it work for us.

Because that will look different for each of us. You know, not everyone will have to sit down and have a plan and talk to their family. But for me, it was really important that they understood that I wasn't being reckless.

Yeah, I love how women, become the hero of our own story. Like we claim it, we own it. If I want to move from a C suite to an individual contributor, that's my choice. It's not the fact of me giving up, it's me making a choice that something has shifted, and I want to focus my self on what's more important to me at this moment.

It doesn't mean you don't care about the company anymore It doesn't mean you didn't care about the work you did. Doesn't mean you have to feel guilty about it. It's just you're making the choice. You're owning it. You're being the hero of your story. I really like I like that Charlene, that's the kind of feeling you're giving us with your story

Yes, we are the hero of our own stories. And I think that's the important thing to remember because oftentimes I will meet with people that will say, I really wasn't happy in my role. I wanted to advocate for something else or do something else, but then they wind up getting laid off.

And that's the thing that pushes them, right? It's like this external event, but I love always telling women, you are the hero of your own story. You don't have to wait till layoff. You don't have to wait till a global pandemic. To make a different decision. And I always say, let's keep it very simple.

If we think about the childhood game that we played with the cards, the matching cards, and maybe it would have a basketball on one side or a boat on the other side. And you'd flip up one and you try to find the match. Well, when you didn't find the match, you didn't get stressed out. You just flipped them over no match.

And I think if we look at that very simple concept with our lives, right. In our careers, you can look at your career right now. And I'm in the C suite is the C suite still a match? Yes or no. And if it's no match, then there's no guilt. There's no shame. There should be no self-condemnation. It should be that it's not a match.

And what is a current match for me now? So, I can keep turning over things and see what that is. Is that an individual contributor role? Is that stepping into consulting? Is that transitioning into a new industry or different work? Like, what does that look like for me? And then when I find a match, I get to say, okay, this feels good.

And I'm going to go in this direction.

I love that. It's just so playful and so, effortless. With less bad stories and I love the ideas of like we are the hero for all the stories that we own that narrative. And that narrative can change to support us instead of to be against us.

I have another question. Now, we know that there are a lot of people. Having a laid off right now, and in between jobs, is there any tips for them to rethink about their career or, especially in, in this kind of in between positions?

Yes, that's a good question. I think that whenever you are in transition or you're between roles, right, let's say that like you're laid off or you've made an exit because something wasn't aligned with where you are.

I think it's a great time to sit down and just look at all of the work that you've done in your career and to really analyze it and say, you know, what task that I like, what roles that I like, what company culture was the best fit for me and really get to understand what work lights you up. What environments light you up, so that as you're out there applying for new roles and new positions, you're not just going on a job description and a skill set, right? You're looking at a total picture of what you're doing. What the company and the offering and the role and the leadership, all of that is right. What the offer is, and you can make the best decision of, is that aligned with what lights me up based on everything that I've experienced so far in my life? I think that's the question you should be asking when you're laid off and looking for a new position.

I love that because the ideas of, I think there's an advantage of being in between, meaning that at least we learn from our past experience the contrast. We know what we don't like or what we like and that is a very useful information to step into a new, a different, a different path or step into a new path because we learn what we want and what we don't want.

I agree because so many times when you're in the work and you're doing the day to day, this is the reason that most people find it so much easier to hire a resume writer than to do it themselves, is you're not thinking of what you're doing. You are doing it at a certain level.

You've mastered the skill set and you're in the work, you're doing it. And then if you've been in a role for an extended period of time, you're certainly not thinking back 10, 15 years ago. Right. What is it that I did? So, if you are in between roles and you have the opportunity to look at all of that, and say, what did I like most? And how do I bring that to the market now? And package it in a way that one makes me a unique candidate so that I stand out, but also allows me to evaluate the opportunities and understand what is best for me at this current moment in my life. Because I think that when you're laid off later in your career, it's not so much about just taking something to make money, right? Because you're established, you have savings most often, all of those things, so you can be more deliberate and intentional in looking at the roles and the opportunities and the offers that you are taking and making sure that you're aligned and the work is meaningful.

I really like that it puts the individual in the driver's seat.

It does. And it brings meaning back, because so many people that I talk to, it's like, I don't know if I'm making an impact, like, people are asking the questions because they know that they're doing the work, but it doesn't always feel like the work is impactful.

Because sometimes we lose sight of the ways in which my task impacts the overall society, community, or company, all of those things. And so, when you're sitting down and you're creating, I like to think of it as creating the perfect dream role for yourself, you get to think about. And what ways do I want to have impact within the organization, within the team, within the world, within the community. And if you're creating a picture of that, then you really are developing your choices and your opportunities and building connections and relationships based on the things that light you up so that hopefully you'll get into that role and it will be something that feels fulfilling and exciting. Which is what more of us are looking for now. Fulfillment. Excitement. Passion. The things that maybe we were missing before.

Yeah, you're right on Charlene. I mean, this is exactly what I hear in my coaching sessions and what all the experts are saying like yourself, like, really own this, really take the time to do the work.

I think you have like three things like, right. You said them in the beginning, like focus on what you value, what you're passionate about, the impact you want to make. And then you start to develop define the types of opportunities you're looking for and be really strategic about how you go about finding them and connecting with people.

It makes sense. It seems easy. It's an easy flow. Um, what can HR leaders do, or managers do to help support this way of thinking or, just allow their employees to do this work?

That's a really good question. I think that traditional HR is thinking about holistically, like, what can the company offer and what benefits do we have to offer to employees?

But I think scaling it back and thinking about it from the employee’s perspective. Because employees are empowered now. Employees are owning their decision making. They understand they're the hero of the story. Like, how do I empower this person that is working for us to really maximize their potential in a way that is fulfilling for them, because I don't think that in my experience, the conversations that I'm having, people are not necessarily leaving companies because there's a lack of opportunity. They're leaving because they're not feeling fulfilled or seen in the roles that they're doing. And so, the shift in HR really needs to be really, how do we focus on making sure that employees are connected with their passions?

And how do we understand what skill sets our current employee population has and maximize the use of those skills? Because a lot of times employees are getting frustrated in roles where they have skills to do something else, but it's not acknowledged. And I think that from the HR and from the corporation level, there should be more focus on understanding, really understanding your employees, who they are, the skills that they have, what's driving them, And how you align to support them in developing their passions.

I think that's so important. Because people want to be passionate. They want to be excited. They want to feel like they're connecting and having deep, meaningful work. And that's not just people that are, you know, mid-career or later in their careers. Gen Z is all about connection and understanding their impact in bigger picture.

It's not about having another pizza party for recognition. Right. It's about really knowing that I'm important and that I'm valued in this role and that you understand who I am and that I'm contributing to something larger than myself. Yeah, exactly. I could imagine if more HR has the awareness of that, a workplace could be much better because it's a simple human connections and simple human acknowledgement instead of machine and policies and all that stuff like that.

Um, yeah, thank you. That's very insightful. Okay, so Charlene, where can our listeners find you and get more of you?

Thank you for asking. So, you can find me at my website is www.unpauseyourdreams.com. You can also find me on LinkedIn as Charlene Ridley. And then you are able to connect with me either on my website by messenger or by email.

Through LinkedIn and messaging me, love to connect with listeners and continue conversations in this way, but also support anyone that is in that place of life where they're thinking that they want to transition into a new dream. And they're really ready to make their someday dreams right now realities.

I'd love to be able to support and offer my support in those roles.

And for all the listeners, she is going to be super supportive to you. If you need her in this moment in time, we'll have all the links to access and connect with Charlene in the show notes for you. Now I want to switch to our lightning round questions, if that's okay with you.

That's okay. Okay. So, four questions with the shortest answers possible. Just another way for our listeners to get to know you. So, first question, where do you go for inspiration? Art. Awesome. I

paint, I'm an oil painter, but I also, I love artists and seeing unique new paintings and get ideas and all sorts of things to step outside of my box and think more creatively through art.

Did you paint the picture behind you? I didn't. This is actually what my clients, but I'm always saying that I want to get to this level. I tend to do more landscape work. I really like the landscapes and some abstract landscape work too.

Very cool. Yeah. That's the creative side of you.

Actually, that's something that I had to step into when I left corporate.

I was purposeful in deciding because I worked in data, which can be very rigid. And I said, I've always wanted to be a painter, and I am going to practice the skill of thinking outside of the box and not being committed to a right by enrolling in painting classes. Awesome.

I'm glad I dug a little deeper there, because that's really interesting.

Oh, a second question. What is one habit you adopted that has greatly improved your career?

One habit? Self-advocacy has been the biggest habit of learning to identify what I want or need and then having the courage to ask for it. It has been huge in my career.

Great. What is one thing that keeps you moving forward each day?

Well, I have a dream of helping 1 million people live their dreams, because I believe that the world will be made happier, and it will be a better place when we are doing that. And so that keeps me moving forward and having conversations to do exactly that.

Beautiful dream.

Very different than data though, isn't it?

Yes, yes. You're painting outside the lines for sure. Yes. Last question, what is the most valuable piece of advice you ever received?

The most valuable piece of advice. Oh, Charlene, you are not obligated to be who you were yesterday. You decide. Most valuable piece of advice.

Wow! That was awesome. Thank you so much.

Thank you, Charlene, for coming in and sharing your wisdom, sharing your insights. And I'm pretty sure this is going to be very helpful for a lot of people.

I really recommend any listeners who want to connect with Charlene, please go ahead because I think we all need support. Especially in this kind of time where we're thinking and reflecting.

Thank you. Laura and Christine.

Thank you everyone.

Hey listeners. We'd like to share that we're launching a course on September 9th, titled Mastering Your Performance Teview. If you're dreading your next performance review, it's time for a change. Your review isn't just about what you've done. It's about how you communicate it, how you present your achievements can make them unforgettable; helping you stand out and master your performance review. You can register early and find out more about the course on our website. Women's career mastery.com/performance review course. A link is provided in the show notes.

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