Laughing Through the Dirt: Finding Joy in Unexpected Places

What do worms and laughter have in common? For Cathy Nesbitt, they’re both part of a life-changing journey. Cathy shares how she built a business around vermicomposting despite resistance, and how laughter wellness became her way of healing burnout and helping others feel better too. This is an uplifting episode about purpose, persistence, and giving yourself permission to be different. We talk mental health, misunderstood missions, and the power of joy in business and life.

https://www.cathyscomposters.com/ https://www.cathysclub.com/ https://www.cathyssprouters.com/ https://www.linkedin.com/in/cathynesbitt/ https://www.youtube.com/@CathyLaughter

nikkis-lounge-2025-03-061746 Cathy Nesbit
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Speaker: [00:00:00] Hi Nikki. My name's Kathy Nesbitt, and my working title is Kathy Crawley, laughing Bean Queen. I offer simple solutions for today's challenges, worms for indoor composting, for amending the soil sprouts for eating, grow your own, and laughter for overall health and wellness.

It's Kathy's Crawly. Composters. Okay. It's indoor composting with worms. So Worm's in the house. I guess I'm not, you're not gonna be one of my clients.

So how it came about, Nikki, is I'm located in Canada, just north of Toronto, and in 2002 our landfill closed and we started to export our garbage to the us. Sorry about that. Almost a thousand trucks a week. Were making the trip from the Toronto area to Michigan, almost a thousand trucks a week. 

Speaker 3: Well, nobody lives in Michigan, literally fine.

And nobody lives in Michigan. Your trash is fine there. [00:01:00] 

Speaker: Well, it's not just Canadian trash that goes there, it's trash from the surrounding states as well. They get all of New York's trash as well. And Michigan is the great lake state. I mean, so it's really not a solution we can say, we'll just send it away, but away is where we live.

There's only one planet. So saying that it's going over there and now it's not my problem. Right outta sight, outta mind. 

It's not really, it's still our problem. So I had a solution. This is, composting. Are you familiar with regular composting? 

Speaker 3: Yes. I had a friend in high school who did it.

Speaker: Beautiful. So everything So composting for those?

Yeah, so for those that are listening that aren't sure about composting, it's nature's way to look after our organic matter. So our food scraps from the kitchen, our paper waste, our yard waste, and no special equipment is required. Maybe you have a pile or you have an actual [00:02:00] composter. You put in your materials, you turn it, add water.

After a certain amount of time, it turns into compost that you can use on your garden. So it's a way for us to use, instead of calling it garbage. 'cause nature doesn't create garbage. We do, we, we can turn, it's a resource. So we turn that organic matter into humus or compost that we can. So then we don't have to apply chemicals.

And so this is the same idea in Toronto, there's about 6 million people half live in condos, townhouses without spaces, without place to do, composting outside. So this is worms in the house, and I became an accidental entrepreneur. I didn't know I just had this solution. It just came to me and I was like, oh, that's a great idea.

And I set forth, I started my business thinking, this is so great. And then I realized, oh my gosh, people are afraid of worms like you. Maybe they don't like creepy crawley, spiders, other crawley things and worms. You [00:03:00] know, worms like snakes. They don't have legs, so they freak people out. And I was all excited.

I'm like, okay, you need to have this. But people don't buy what they need. They buy what they want and they didn't want what I was flogging and I, I wasn't paying attention. You know, as an entrepreneur, they say pay attention to what the client wants and they didn't want what I had. And I realized early on, okay, I, what am I gonna do?

So I started to do school workshops. So my business turned into education and I became a speaker and over a hundred thousand students have seen my presentation. Wow. Thank you. Wow. So beautiful. That's good. Yeah, so what I do with that is I go into the school, into the classroom and I set this, the class up with a worm bin, right?

In this, in the classroom. So it's again, for the, those that are listening and for you, and maybe you'll never have worms, but at least [00:04:00] you can understand what it is.

Any container will do, they're not free range. They're not roaming around the house. Shoot, that's a good plus. So they're in, say, a Rubbermaid tote.

The bedding is your shredded paper and the nitrate, so that's the carbon, the nitrogen is your food scraps, banana peels, tea bags, potato peels, et cetera. You add both the worms, eat it all, and their poop is the black gold that's the nutrient rich fertilizer. And it's so beautiful.

It's so beautiful if you look worms, but here's some fun facts. Here's some fun facts for you about worms. They have five hearts each. Wow. They turn garbage into gold. They live up to 10 years and they're the original alchemists. 

Speaker 3: Does it smell? 

Speaker: I love that question. We're adding and rotting food.

It must smell, right? No, this is aerobic process, meaning with [00:05:00] oxygen, the worms breathe oxygen, we breathe oxygen, they breathe through their skin. That's the only thing. It's a different, they don't have lungs. They breathe like frogs. They breathe through their skin. The odor, if the, if it has a bad smell, the oxygen has now been converted into methane, so now it's turned into gas.

We can't breathe gas. The worms can't breathe gas. So I really, it's like a built-in mechanism so we know if there's an odor when we open up our worm bin, if there's an odor action is required. 

Speaker 3: Okay. That makes a little bit more Okay. 

Speaker: A little bit. And they're gonna stay in the bin, so they can't see, they don't have eyes.

So no point in going sightseeing. They're gonna, eat half their weight per day. So for easy math, I'm gonna use a pound of worms. If you had a pound of worms in your bin, you could add, half a pound per day, or three to four pounds of food waste per week. So imagine, Nikki, everybody having a worm bin.

Imagine they weren't freeto [00:06:00] by worms. So there, so if everybody had worms, that, this is the beautiful part, I think when people understand why we need worms, it's easier for us to overcome the icfa factor. 

And I was grossed out too before starting my business. I was like, Ew, worms in the house.

And how that, how it came about for me was in 93, I bought my house. I moved out of Toronto into a small town. And in 93, a teacher friend asked me to look after her worm bin for the summer. She had worms in her classroom, and she was going away. She needed someone to a worm babysitter.

So I said, okay. Even though I was like, Ugh, I don't want worms in my house, gross. I come from a place where I think we should try things. People are like, oh, you won't like it. Good. Just gimme a list. Like, gimme a list of things I won't like so I can save my time. Nothing for everybody, right? Like some people like spiders, some people like worms, some people like, liver.

[00:07:00] Ew. 

Speaker 3: Yeah, I agree on that one. 

Speaker: Right? So, so I took on the challenge and that summer was really awful. I had this worm bin in my basement. I would open up the lid, I would throw the food, and I would close the lid. I didn't want worms. Gross. And at the end of the summer, so here's what happened. I was a fruit fly farmer.

And if you've ever had fruit flies in your house, and you haven't had a worm bin, you know that the fruit flies don't come from the worm bin. They come from the fruit. The fruit, like bananas, oranges, right there on the fruit. 

We wash the apple, we wash the pear and we eat it. So we're not gonna have fruit flies in our belly if we eat the fruit fly eggs, the bananas, the oranges, the things that we peel, we don't generally wash it first, right?

So the fruit fly eggs are on those peels, and that's how they get in our house. So by throwing up my peels into my worm bin. They're decomposers, right? So [00:08:00] they're chewing up the food for the worms. They have a nice symbio, symbiotic relationship. They don't get bugged. We get bugged 'cause we call them bugs.

By the fruit flies, they get in your wine and stuff.

Yeah. So that summer, oh my gosh. I would open up the lid. Every, oh, a swarm of fruit flies would fly out. And I was like, ah, this is really awful. I don't, ugh. At the end of the summer, I put on big gloves. I wanted to get the black gold. That's why I said yes. I separated the worms from the compost, gave my friend back the worms, kept them alive, hallelujah.

And had the black gold. And then I said, I'm never doing this again. I'm never doing this again because gross, I'll just buy worm poo right From the many worm farmers a around like, have you ever met a worm farmer before? Nikki? 

Speaker 3: No. Honestly cannot say that. 

Speaker: Yay. Nice to meet you. Right. So, so I, that's what I [00:09:00] heard from other people.

All just, I don't wanna do the process. I want the end product. So for anyone listening, thinking I'm gonna start a worm farm. Start a worm farm with the, the idea of selling the end product, I said I'm gonna sell the worms. 'cause I want everyone to have worms. 

Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. 

Speaker: I want everyone to do this. So on a small scale, right?

I wasn't thinking, oh, I can manage the whole city of Toronto's waste. No. I want you to have worms and you, and you, and you like Oprah. Everyone gets a car, everyone gets a word then. Hallelujah. And it's harder than I thought. I have a psych degree and I'm fascinated why people do what they do and why didn't they want what I wanted?

Because, during elementary school, after a rainy day, they might've been chased around. By the school bully or a sibling maybe chased them around or a fishing incident. Have you ever been fishing in the green goo gross, right? It's like, oh no, the poor worm. 

Speaker 3: Yeah. [00:10:00] I think my sister hooked my uncle in the hand when the one time I went fishing, I didn't particularly like it.

I find fishing to be very boring and I play a game and every single one of the games I play has a fishing element, like, go catch this fish, or go catch that fish. And I'm like, no, I don't wanna, it's boring. I don't like it. And so I end up pitching in games when I don't even want to. But yeah, no, I think the only time I went in real life, my older sister went to put her, you know, did the thing back to go forward and she hooked it and then set it into my uncle's hand.

Speaker 4: Ooh. Ah, 

Speaker 3: I gotcha. Uncle. If uncle say, uncle, if my memory serves, and I'm pretty sure it does, he was none too pleased with that. 

Speaker: I imagine a little bit of pain from the sharp hook. Sure. Yeah. Mm-hmm. I'm 

[00:11:00] getting out of his hand was hard. 

I'm certain. Yes. Yeah. 'cause that Barb is meant to, to keep the, it's only meant to go one way.

That's it. That's it. Yes. I must admit, I'm not a fisher either. I did fish as a kid at the cottage and stuff, but I couldn't put the worm on and I couldn't take the fish off. So yeah. I wasn't a very good fisher and boring. Agreed. I mean, now I might enjoy it more, but I might enjoy not fishing and just having my book and reading.

Speaker 3: That would be me. I You wanna fish? Go ahead. I'll come with you. I'll keep you company. If you're quiet enough that I can read and Right. And have your snacks and water. Water, yeah. 

Speaker: Same. Yeah. Actually, I like canoeing, but the canoeing part that I like is just having my book and floating in the middle of the lake.

I don't like the paddling part.

Speaker 3: I think that's an important part of canoeing though. 

Speaker: I need people, I mean, I need people, Nikki. [00:12:00] Yeah. So 23 years, I've had my worm composting business. 23 years. 23 years. Can you, Ima selling worms by the pound and I'm an accidental entrepreneur. I didn't even know that it was an option for me. I thought, you know, I grew up in, in the sixties and I grew up at a time, the message that I received that women could be five things.

Let's see if I remember. Secretary, nurse stewardess, waitress. One more nurse, teacher, maybe teacher. Did I say nurse, nurse, teacher, secretary. Anyway, five things. So I was like, that's a pretty limited list. Mm-hmm. It's limited, although, it had its value because I said, okay, I have those five things.

I'll be a secretary. So I took all the courses, business, English, shorthand typing, which typing is a great skill today. Mm-hmm. Keyboarding. Oh, so beautiful. And as a secretary, I was an office [00:13:00] worker nine to five. I had my hours, I left, closed my door, my drawer. At the end of the day I went home.

I didn't worry about, it wasn't my business. 

I did my job well and then I would go home and not worry about work weekends off. Right. My holidays, everything in place. So there's definitely benefic benefits from having like an office job. Where you get all the things 

Speaker 3: go ahead.

There's a sense of security. That's it anyway, because you know how much you're getting paid, you know how much time you can take off and not get fired. You know the people you're going to work with every day. Whereas as an entrepreneur, if somebody decides not to pay me one month because they're having a shortfall, that creates a domino effect.

And now there's a shortfall. I mean, I can weather that, but some people can't. Some people are at the point where they're [00:14:00] just starting out and that one person not paying could be detrimental to being able to keep their business open. So it's a little more risky. A lot more risky because there's not, like, I've worked 50 hours this week, I'm going to get paid $2,000.

It's not how it works. I work 80 hours a week and I still get paid the same amount. Right. That's it. But there's none of that. But the satisfaction is that you are building something of 

Speaker: your own. 

Yeah. I think, to be an entrepreneur takes a lot of discipline.

You have to have the right mindset. You gotta be motivated. It's easy to get up and be like, okay, I'm just gonna scroll on social media for a while. That, I mean, that's your option as the entrepreneur. That doesn't bring in business unless you're scrolling where your customers are.

But they're probably not in the cute cat videos. 

Speaker 3: Ah, probably not. Right. So, 

Speaker: yeah, 

Speaker 3: go ahead. But I [00:15:00] can take, like this morning, my appointments didn't start until this one. Okay. So, I was like, well, I'm just gonna chill out this morning. I am not gonna, I have been putting in the hours. I'm not saying I'm not working, I'm not saying that I'm not disciplined about it, but this morning I was just like, oh, so I'm not gonna, you can make me, and because I work for myself, I can do that.

Yeah. And again, I have been putting in the hours, so there's no, none of my customers are going to feel that. I didn't work for a couple hours this morning, so it was just a, okay, I just need a break. And then I'm gonna do a podcast and it will be fun. Yes. And it's been fun. So like, yay. But yeah, but you do have that option.

Whereas if this was a nine to five job and I decided not to go to work for three hours in the morning, 'cause I didn't wanna, nobody could make me. [00:16:00] I might not have my job for very long. That's great. If I do it repeatedly, 

Speaker: that's it. That's it. So there, so it's a trade off of your free, kind of your freedom and being the boss.

But then you gotta be all the things, especially if you're starting out, you're wearing all the hats, right? You're the marketer, you're the bookkeeper, you are the bottle washer. You're doing all the jobs until you're able to hire somebody. And what do they say? Hire out your weaknesses.

Like, stop trying to do the bookkeeping if numbers is not your thing. Hire somebody for that so you can do the higher paying jobs. 

Speaker 3: I have a lady that, she's not somebody I have working with me every single month and I'm not sure that she would like to, I am a little weird, let's not lie. But I know that if I have one of those monotonous tasks, that means clicking on some stuff and copying and pasting it from one place to another place that's going to just in, no, [00:17:00] I'm gonna have my moment where I'm just like, I don't wanna, you can't make me.

And so it may take me a bit. 'cause sometimes like, no, I have to do that 'cause I have to. It's my job, like I have to do it. No. This week I went to her and was like, okay, look, you need to do this 'cause I'm not ripping my own head off in this situation's. Not worth it. Go fix. Please fix, please.

Thank you. And she's like, yeah, sure. I love doing the monotonous things. So like if you have something like that where, so for me it's not so much that I need to get information from point A to point B because if it was as simple as that, I would just do Zapier and be done with it. But my calendar for my podcasting doesn't, translate well to Zapier at all.

What is Zapier? I haven't heard 

Speaker: of this. 

Speaker 3: Zapier is automation. So I use it in one spot to [00:18:00] get, so I use it in one program to go to my go high level account so that my contacts automatically flow over there. Oh, okay. And I don't have to do the work of going, oh, I have a list. Go grab it, put it over there.

So it just kind of take it, it automates, the transition from one thing, one piece of software to another. 

Usually it can be done really easily, but all the information I need from the podcast form you filled out for this? Yes. You know how long that was. That doesn't translate very well into Zapier, so I was like, okay.

And so I would have to open my calendar to that calendar item, open my, notion, which is what I'm trying to put it all into so I can keep it organized better and then paste all the information in. Okay, no, I'm done. Because that was just 17 clicks and three hours to do one person. And I'm not in it for that.

That is boring to me. I have [00:19:00] a lot of hats that I wear. I do office management, I do video editing. I do, tech. I help people with tech to make sure that they have the right tech. And I teach them how to use their tech so that they're doing things better. So like I do a wide range of things because I'm one of those people, if I'm sending emails out all day every day,

this is gonna be good for nobody. 'cause everybody's gonna know that I'm unhappy with what I'm doing. Very boring to me. So I have a lot of different tasks that I do for all of my different clients, and everybody has a different thing that they have me do. And I can keep it all in check. But I also had a lot of interest in my podcast this year.

So like making sure that I'm on track on editing and keeping up with everything is getting messy. Mm-hmm. And so I need it in one spot. And so I went to her and she was like, yeah, I'd love to help you with that. Not a problem. And I went, great. [00:20:00] Have fun. Yeah. 'cause then I don't have to do it. But if you're not at a point where you can do that.

Then you have to do the, but I wanna because you're the only one who can because 

Speaker: Yeah. And the secret is to do it first. Mm-hmm. What do they say? Eat the big take the eat the frog first or whatever. I don't know what the expression is, but

Speaker 3: If you have something on your plate that you don't want to eat, you, I don't know, for me, I'm not eating it.

So there's that. But normally people, I guess, eat the least favorite thing on their plate and then go up until the favorite thing is last, and then they eat the most enjoyable part last. That's why you have dessert after you're done with your main meal. Most people, there are some people who are like, screw the system.

I'm having dessert first. But they're rare. I like them, but they're rare. That's true. 

Speaker: Yes. Yeah. So if you do the tasks that you don't wanna do and you get it done, [00:21:00] oh, it's so much easier to get the other things done. And everyone's in that boat, where you're have things that you like to do and things that you don't like to do.

As long as you have more things you like to do in a day, the day is pretty good. Right. You gotta weigh it out. And for me, being an entrepreneur is so, it's satisfying. It's a roller coaster. You get a contract, you're like, yay, woo, like money coming in. Then you gotta do that contract. And while you're doing that contract, you're not fishing for more clients, for the fishing, metaphor again, to keep that going, even though we don't like fishing.

Yeah. So it's really an interesting kind of, not even balance. It's not even a balance. I don't know. Yeah. Because

Speaker 3: you do have to be looking for the next client while you're still taking care of your current clients, because maybe you're not where you wanna be monetarily yet with the clients you do have and or if you're me, you're like, oh, but you know what?

I [00:22:00] could help people by doing this. Okay. And then you have to build that up and start, you know, explaining to people why that is a good idea and why they should hire you to do the good idea, 

Speaker: right? Yes. Yeah. Well, I mean, everything's marketing. Everything is marketing. If you don't, you might have the best product or service.

Mm-hmm. If nobody knows, nobody's calling, nobody's emailing, nobody's texting. 

Speaker 3: I was in a group of entrepreneurs that talked with these people that would help us, and one of the things they said is, are you running a secret business? 'cause if you're not letting people know that you have a business or that, you know, if you don't see somebody struggling with something that you can help with and you don't say, Hey, I can help you with that because you're all oh, but they won't like me if I say something and I'm, believe me, my head does that, but there's this thing that I've learned and it's [00:23:00] called Shut up.

And you say that if you're in public, don't say it out loud, but if you're at your desk, say it out loud. 'cause sometimes you need to hear it in your ears just as much as you need to hear it internally. Right. And you just say, shut up. Get that voice to shut up. I make, I'm being very flippant. That is not an easy thing to do.

I have gotten to a point where I could do it. It may take you time, but it is something you can do. And you say, shut up. And your brain goes, oh yeah. What? Now wait a minute, you were just rude. Yeah. But in that way you're stopping it from doing the spiral. 'cause we don't like, the parachute that doesn't open.

Right. You don't want a Roman candle down into the ground. It's not a good idea. 

So you stop it and you stop it abruptly by just telling yourself to shut up. And then you go, Hey, I can help you with that. And then you do the nervous, finger thing or whatever, but [00:24:00] you're still fine. Oh, that's great.

Doing it when you're nervous doing it, when you're terrified doing it when you're. Upset doing it when you are not at your best will teach you when to, that you can do it at your worst. I love it. You don't always have to be your best in order to go, look, I'm having an off day, but I'm pretty sure I can help you with what you're doing.

Let's breathe for a second. 'cause you seem kind of upset. What's wrong? You know, and I've helped people like that. 'cause I'll have somebody call me and they're like, the thing, it won't work. I don't know if you know this, but that is the least helpful thing to say about a computer because there's a lot of, it doesn't work that like I have to like troubleshoot now.

So I'm like, okay, first you're gonna breathe. [00:25:00] And realize that I can help, but only if you actually tell me what's happening because it doesn't work is not a statement. I know what to do with, is it the software not working? Is it the laptop not working? Is your power on like what is not working?

Speaker: Oh, that's a great strategy though. And it is a practice because we've been told our whole life, like kind of this lie of. Especially as women, don't cause ruffles and you know. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Don't cause trouble and don't be too loud and all the things. And I think that we just need to, we need to just, yeah.

Tell your voice. I've named my voice in my head and it's Nelly, sorry for anyone named Nelly out there, like negative Nelly or neg niggling Nel Nelly, who's Ooh, why do you think you can do that? And everybody has it. Every, everybody has this kind of imposter syndrome. Mm-hmm. And we need to barrel through that.

And just as you said, even if you're feeling [00:26:00] like not sure something that I do, I love that telling your voice to shut up. That's, it's really good. 'cause it's like, huh. 

Speaker 3: It's powerful. So I have an agreement though, with like the entire universe at this point. I have a lot of mental health stuff and I have to regularly check in with somebody who is like, are you hallucinating?

And me saying, no, Nelly is saying I'm good, would totally get me put in a straight jacket. So let's do that. If that is the case with you too, be a little bit careful, but so like I don't have like a name for it. It's just that, you know, I've been through a lot of trauma and I don't like saying it like that 'cause that's trauma.

But, I had a bad therapist every time I said something to her. She was, but you've just been through so much trauma. If you invalidate what I'm going through one more time. You are just lucky you're on the other side of the computer and I can't do nothing about it. [00:27:00] Can't reach you. She's a nice lady.

She just did not know how to handle me, which is, I get it. 'cause I'm a lot to handle some days. But we do get told that you're a lot to handle. You're a little too loud. Why aren't you being, what was that stupid thing going around here lately? Very demure, very mindful, whatever, like weirdness of that. I don't even, I don't know the story behind it.

I am being completely me 'cause I don't pay attention to none of that stuff. But I did catch it on a couple of people that I do watch and I'm just like, what is. But, you're supposed to, at least as a female, be quiet and not salesy and not step forward too much and don't tell this person you're doing this because they might get offended.

'cause they do something similar. Guess what? The people I work with, the people who I network [00:28:00] with, some of them do stuff similar to what I do. And you know what that means? They come to me too when they have a problem. I go to them when I have a problem. Like I'm pretty okay with ai, but if I get to a point where I'm about to rip my hair out, which you know, is very long, very pretty, like it's a bad idea.

I know I have somebody I can go to and be like, okay, you are so much better at than me at ai. Give me a prompt that will help me fix this. And she'll be like, oh yeah, I just had to deal with that problem the other day. Here you go. Right? Yes. 

Speaker: Simple. I love it. 'cause 

Speaker 3: we work together. We're not enemies, we're not competing for the same crowd.

There's no competition. We're just two people who are doing a, who have a business, who work together on things. I've helped her with some of her stuff, so she's paid [00:29:00] me. She's helped me with some stuff, so I've paid her like it's a mutual thing that goes back and forth. I never know from time to time who's gonna be paying who next month.

Speaker: Yeah. I find that women are almost better at that. Or maybe we're all coming to a different place. But it feels like, when I was networking with mixed groups, men and women. Mm-hmm. It's a different feel than with just women. Women are, I just as a generalization, it seems like men are like, oh, I have this great idea.

Not yet. I can't share it yet. I'm not gonna tell you. Everything. More guarded where women are like, oh, I have this thing, it works great for me here. Do you wanna try it? Oh, here, here, here. And and we do wanna collaborate. And you said it, we're not competitors, even if we're in the same space.

There's lots, we need to come from a mentality of abundance rather than scarcity. Like, oh, not enough. I gotta keep it guarded. There's, there are lots, 

Speaker 3: there are 7 billion people on this planet. There are [00:30:00] enough people that I can hire. The co, I'm not gonna be able to work with a million people, right.

I'm not gonna be able to work with a thousand people. At least not yet. I'm not geared up for that. Right. 

Speaker 2: That's it. 

Speaker 3: But if I have somebody who comes to me and they want super specific something, you know what? I would love to help you, but I think that this other person would be way better fit because they do, they are more niched down into what you're talking about than I am.

And they're like, okay, I appreciate that. Yeah. And that leaves the door open so that if they do need something that only I can do later, because a lot of the people I work with are not as good with the computer side of things or, using their tech in the best ways possible. Right? They have all these texts that they've gotten, whether through App Sumo or just, Facebook throws some software at you when you're an entrepreneur and they know it, right?

[00:31:00] So. You get all this software and you're like, oh yeah, I'm using Notion today. I might switch back to Trello tomorrow. I don't know. Might have to think about it. I use both for different reasons. So I mean, there's that, but there's so much that out there, there are so many people out there that need help with a wide range of things that as women or even just as people, like, it doesn't even necessarily have to be that I'm a female, so I'm gonna only work with somebody who's a female.

No, I will work with somebody as long as I feel comfortable enough talking to them and letting them know, Hey, I have this person who talked to me, but I think you'd be a better fit. 

Speaker: Yeah, I think it's like any teacher, there's all kinds of like yoga instructors and some you might be like, oh, I don't like the way they teach.

And this one you're like, oh, I love yoga. With this person or anything? Any dance or any, [00:32:00] lesson. Everyone is different. I'm not like for yoga, but No, I don't even like yoga, but 

Speaker 3: just laughter. Yoga, just an example. But like if we look at the people around us and we're constantly thinking they're going to steal from me, you have way bigger of a problem then your business not being successful.

Speaker: Yeah. True enough. That's for sure. Yeah. We, you know, as entrepreneurs we do need to do a certain amount of self-care. Because otherwise we can get hung up in the matrix of it all and just be like comparing, oh, they have that. And that's what social media does is, you know, we look at, oh, look at that person there.

Because people are showing just their highlight reel. Like, oh, look at me here I was, this is 10 years ago, but it looks like I'm today. 

Speaker 3: You know, my big thing is cooking. Everybody's like, look, I did this in one pan. [00:33:00] Dude, if it's a casserole, sure. It might be the truth. Right? Except for the fact that you have to boil the noodles before you can put them in that thing.

So there you go. They've lied to you already, but they also show you like this clean kitchen. And they're like, my life is perfect and I only home cook for my man. Yeah. That's why in that garbage can that we can't see because you've hidden it. There's a McDonald's bag. Everybody at some point or another has lied on social media.

Speaker: Right? Agreed. 

Speaker 3: Most of the time, not even trying to troll anybody, but by, they're like, oh, well this person said they did it in this, and might've taken me more pans, but I still came out with a great thing. So I'll just hide those pans and say, I did it in the one pan. 

Speaker 2: Yeah, because 

it's usually those cooking things where we're all like, yeah, that came from [00:34:00] a box.

Not like, you see those cake videos where they're just like, yeah, this is super realistic and you can do this at home. No, honey. No, I can't. Right. There's absolutely not enough. Artistic ability in my bones to be able to make a cake look like Finding Nemo, which is not gonna happen. Right. I think it's awesome.

Yeah. I think it's totally awesome, especially when they do it with cakes and not half cake, half rice crispy treats. I think it's awesome. You do. You get it? 'cause like you deserve the money for that, right? Hmm. But no, not everybody else. Not everybody can do that. Absolutely. Not everybody can do that. 

Yeah.

Speaker 3: Does that mean you get paid for that? Yes. If somebody wants one of your ultra realistic cakes, they better be willing to pay up for it because that's, they take time. 

Speaker 2: Yeah. 

Speaker 3: And here's the [00:35:00] secret that a lot of people don't tell you. It could take me 10 minutes to figure out the problem with your software.

Do you know why it took me 10 minutes? Because I have years behind me of looking and doing and dealing with it. Right? Right. The same with your roofer, like your roof is not the first roof your roofer has ever been on. They have years behind them usually, or training behind them, right? And everybody's like, well, it only took you five minutes to do that fix, so it should be 

minutes.

Oh, less money minutes. It's worth of 

time, 

Speaker: right? No, 

Speaker 3: no. You're paying for my expertise and you're gonna pay for four hour for the courses that I took, and 

Speaker: yeah, 

Speaker 3: you're gonna pay for the hour because I'm now gonna teach you how to not make that same mistake again. Like I'm being realistic, right? Like, it's gonna take time and energy to fix the mistake and then make sure you [00:36:00] don't do it again.

But it's also because I know what I'm doing and you don't. That's it. I can teach you how to do it and not help you fix it. Where's that gonna get you? 

Speaker: That's it. Yeah. So, yeah, going back to not doing the things that you don't wanna do. Or not able, like Yeah, everyone can figure it out.

'cause you can Google how do I do this and then do that step, and then how do I go, you know? And that's taking, that's eating up your whole day and now you've done the job that Nikki could do in 10 minutes. It's taken your whole workday. 

Speaker 3: And some people, if you work for a corporation at taking your whole workday isn't really your problem.

Because you're fixing, you have to, and actually, and a corporation, you're calling the IT department and you're going, it's broken. Come fix it. And then they have to come up and do the thing, which again will take them about 10 minutes, maybe a little bit longer, maybe less, depends on how fubar your computer is.

And then they go back into the depths of nowhere [00:37:00] land and you keep working. It's gonna take training on somebody's part to get something fixed. It always does. 

Speaker 2: Yeah. It's not at 

Speaker 3: Google. Google is a university all of its own. And I could tell you now, if you go off of people's opinion on how to take a toilet bowl off of the floor and put a new one in, you'll have hundreds of different opinions on something that is like a three step process.

Yes. Maybe four. Wildly overestimating plumbers do not come from me. I don't know how to do that. I don't want to know how to do that. That is somebody's crappy job edits. Nevermind. I'm very grateful for the people who do it but us. Not my 

Speaker: job. And they get great pleasure from it. My book, I don't like numbers, I don't like doing my books and stuff, but my bookkeeper, she loves it.

Speaker 2: Right? 

Speaker: She loves making everything balance and it's all whatever, finding mistakes and stuff. [00:38:00] 'Cause numbers don't lie, so you can't really make it up. But for me it's like, no, that would be an exercise and really frustration. 

Speaker 3: Oh yeah, no, I totally get that. I help a couple of companies with their QuickBooks and end of year is always a nightmare for me.

'cause I call the accountant and I go, okay, look, I don't know what I did,

but I boo barred something and I can't fix it. And she'll go, oh, I see what you did. And it's a two second fix. And I'm like, thank you, Jesus. I didn't do stupid, I just screwed up a tiny thing, which. It could be actually a tiny thing or could be bigger, but like she knows how to fix it quick. I don't know the difference.

And I'm not trying to know, not my monkey, not my circus. 

Speaker: That's it. 

Speaker 3: Once I go to somebody with a problem, it is now [00:39:00] theirs.

Speaker 5: Hey everyone. Thanks for sticking with us. Before we dive into our next topic, I just wanna take a quick moment to remind you two who like this video, subscribe to our channel and hit that notification bell. That way you'll always be the first to know when a new episode drops, and we want to hear from you.

What topics are you most excited about? Drop your thoughts in. The comments below. Your feedback helps us create content that you love. We've got some exciting stuff coming your way, so don't miss out. Now let's switch gears and jump into our next discussion.

Speaker 3: So I know that you also wanted to, help talk about mental health. 

Speaker: Would love it and I think we've 

Speaker 3: touched a tiny bit on it in a couple places, but, i'd really like to speak more on that.

Speaker: Yeah, me too. Oh my gosh. So it's the 23rd anniversary of the worms in 2012. So 10 years into my worm mission, one more person said, Ew, worms in the house. And I'd heard it [00:40:00] hundreds of times, Nikki, I'd heard it so many times, I wasn't paying attention. I'm like, la, la, la, la, la. No, you need this. People don't buy what they need.

They buy what they want. Oh, and that in 2012, oh my gosh, Nikki. I felt it. I heard it. I questioned everything. I was like, universe, what do you want from me? I don't know what to do. How do I get people to understand the importance of these beautiful worms? And the very next day, I was introduced to laughter yoga.

I know we touched on yoga. I don't do yoga. I still don't do yoga. I jumped right to the fun yoga. So laughter yoga. So, yeah, so just quickly about laughter Yoga started in 1995 by a medical doctor and his goal is world peace, like how beautiful. And I believe it was started in 1995 so that we could be ready for 2020 when the world shut down.

So 2012 I got introduced to Laughter yoga. I was at a business meeting and the [00:41:00] speaker did a five minute introduction to into Laughter Yoga. And I was like, huh, laughter yoga. What's that? I love to laugh. And then that same week, 2012, I was at a networking event. Hundreds of people. The very first woman I met was a laughter yoga teacher.

And I said, laughter yoga's mainstream like twice in one week. Come on. And she, I think she got offended. She was like, no, it isn't. And we trooped around that night together and everyone we met, I'd say, have you heard of laughter yoga? Have you, nobody had heard of laughter yoga? And I was like, oh, interesting.

So this was in Toronto and this laughter yoga teacher had a laughter club, five minute walk from where my mother-in-law lived. And I loved my mother-in-law. And she used to tell people, whenever Kathy asked me to do something, I say Yes. 'cause it's always an adventure. So I called her up and I said, Hey Mary, what do we wanna go to?

Laughter yoga? And she said, what's that? And I said, I don't know, but I don't wanna go alone. So we went to [00:42:00] Laughter Yoga and it became our date night. It was a monthly club. We'd go for dinner and she was so awesome. My mother-in-law was so beautiful. She would say, we better not have garlic. So concerned about everyone.

I'm like, no. As long as we both have it. Ha ha ha ha. The garlic fumes wafting out of our mouth. Yeah, and it was so fun. It's really random. Have you heard of laughter Yoga Nikki? 

Speaker 3: Not before you. 

Speaker: Okay. Beautiful. So, laughter yoga is not about doing yoga. It's not fancy pants or poses.

It's laughing. Laughing is a cardiovascular workout. The yoga part of laughter yoga is the practice of the laughter and the deep diaphragmatic breathing. Mm-hmm. So there's little games to inspire the laughter. I mean, if you go to a laughter club and it's all laughter professionals, we don't need little games.

We, we, there is little games, but we don't really need that. We're just like, we're there to laugh and ever heard the expression, laughter is the best medicine. [00:43:00] Mm-hmm. Yes. And it is, scientifically proven that it helps calm down our nervous system. It's great for anxiety, depression, frustration.

It gets us out of stress. I say that laughter is the opposite of stress. When we're laughing, we're totally present. So we're not thinking about yesterday, oh, that thing I said, that meeting I had, or tomorrow that I have that thing coming up. Oh, I'm so worried about it. No, we're right here, right now.

We're not even thinking. In fact, when we're laughing full on our knees get weak, like we couldn't even run away. Even if we had to escape, we couldn't if we were laughing. So for the mental health, it really has helped us. And I, you know, I really want people to care about the planet. My worm business, that's my heavy, earth work.

And now with the laughter. So in 2012. I would go to laughter with my mother-in-law. It was kind of like a little hobby, and I love that so much. This [00:44:00] laughter club was at a very pop populated corner of Toronto. There's gotta be 20,000 con like, not condos, but people, condo, apartments.

So like 20,000 people live at this corner every month. The club would get smaller. We started, there was, you know, nine people, then there was eight people, then there was six people, and she had to close her club. She was renting space. So she said, wow, I gotta close my club. I'm not in business to lose business, like to lose money or even to break even when people are like, oh, at least I broke even.

No, you could have stayed home and broke even.

Speaker 2: You don't 

need to do anything to break even. And that's one of my pet peeves when people in business say, oh, I was at this vendor event. I paid for my booth and all the things. And then they go, I broke even. It's like, so after you paid for your booth and your time and everything, you broke even.

So you actually lost money. 'cause what about all your time? It's valuable. Anyway, so I started, so the club closed and I was [00:45:00] like, oh, I was so sad. So I got trained as a laughter leader and I had so much fun with that. I got trained as a teacher. So now I teach leaders. It's a two day training and it's so fun.

And I said, universe, I don't wanna have a free offering. I don't wanna have a free club. So 2016, I started getting paid gigs, doing laughter, going into long-term care school workshops. So much fun. And then 2020. 

Speaker: Then we got shut down in Canada. We were locked down for about two years. Yikes. Like, it's hard even to imagine.

And I was really stressed. I was really afraid like the world, like we didn't know what was happening. And so I said, okay, time for my free offering. And I started my laughter club. It's, it is free. And I would invite all your listeners to come and check it out. June, 2020, I started my online club.

It's 30 minutes of super fun self-care. On Zoom, it's free four and a half years. I get about [00:46:00] 30 little zoom squares and not always the same people. I never know, I don't like you're not in a funnel. Although I do have a laughter business that is my offering to the world. I don't follow up if you register and don't come.

I'm not like, Hey, you signed up and you didn't come. It's like maybe something happened. I don't know. That's not my problem. It's not that it's not my problem. It, I would like them to come and check it out. Yeah. So it, it really for the mental health part, oh, it's so beautiful. It's changed everything For me, before I was trained as a laughter person, when somebody said, oo worms in the house, I took on a certain level, I took it personal, like, Ew, Kathy, or Gross, or, I don't want what you have.

I'm super sensitive, so I would, not that I would cry, but I would be hurt by their ew. Mm-hmm. About what I was like, this is my business. This is my life. What do you mean, Ew, about what I'm offering you and you need it. Mm-hmm. And then 20, so then I got trained, and the laughter has helped me to [00:47:00] become more resilient.

I know now when somebody says, Ew worms in the house, that's on them. That's not my stuff, that's theirs. And I'm able to get over it. And I would love to offer your, you and your listeners a tip. What's, when you're driving and somebody cuts you off. It's never personal unless it is like, Hey, there's Nikki.

Let's get her. 

Speaker 3: I don't particularly enjoy it, so I think it's personal because how dare you? Yes. I don't actually get road rage on the road. I get road rage in Walmart

Speaker 2: when somebody cuts you off with a big cart. 

Speaker 3: No people walking at like 0.1 miles per hour. And you're like, would you just walk, move? Or the people coming out of an aisle who about take you out with their cart when you're in the middle of the aisle before they get there. Like, I'm not small. How'd you miss this?

Speaker: [00:48:00] Yeah. That's my challenge with Costco. I find that people, yeah, they, I don't know what happens. People just become so self-absorbed. 

They're so self-absorbed. Yeah. I get you there. You're not like 

Speaker 3: getting hit by carts. And I get hit by them an awful lot for somebody who is five, six and, not skinny.

Speaker: Yeah. It's, yeah. It's amazing. It's amazing. So the, so for the driving, so if somebody cuts you off, it's generally not personal. They were distracted, they're lane ended, they weren't paying attention and whoops. And so when we cut people off, we know we're like, oh, I cut them off and we're looking in our mirror.

So for me, when somebody cuts me off it, I've trained myself to, now it's time for laughter yoga. So somebody cuts me off. I'm like, oh, laughter yoga time. And I start flailing my arm. I'm what? I'm making cuckoo face. And they're looking and they're like, that checks cuckoo. She's nuts. And they're afraid. Now they're [00:49:00] stressed.

And I'm like, oh, I'm secreting all the love drugs. I'm fully oxygenated, I'm laughing. I feel great. And I get more space. I literally get more room because they think there's something wrong. They think I'm mad 'cause I'm flailing my arm around. It's brilliant strategy. 

Speaker 3: I don't think I've ever used the, I'm nuts back away, slowly.

Excuse on anybody before, but I now find it to be a valid one. 

Speaker: Right? Yeah. Might not 

Speaker 3: do that. 

Speaker: Yeah. It's fascinating with laughter. We really can't multitask. I know. We do. A zillion things, especially as women, we are always, got several balls in the air, but we really are unique tasking.

I mean, we really can only do one thing at a time, but I do multitask with my bike riding, so I ride my bike and I'm incorporating my laughter. And I'm in a small town, so I often see the same people and some of them know, so they'll start laughing. If I go at a different [00:50:00] time, it's a different experience.

But one day I was riding my bike and there was a gentleman with a young girl, it was a grandfather and his grand granddaughter, and they were on a bridge and I talked to everybody. So I get off my bike and I start approaching and I could feel I'm empathic so I could feel that he wasn't very happy that I was approaching.

So I stopped. I said, okay, well have a good day. And I just got on my bike and I went back home. A couple days later I saw that same man without his granddaughter, and I was standing on the bridge. He came up to me and we started talking. He said, when people see people laughing by themselves, they think there's something wrong with them.

And I started laughing. I said, oh, I know. Oh my gosh. And we still were talking when I got, then we finished. I bit him, got on my bike, ran, rode back home. It wasn't until I walked into the living room that it hit me. Oh my gosh. He was talking about me.

I was laughing along to the joke. Oh yeah, I know. [00:51:00] They're nuts. Those people laughing by themself. Oh, ha ha. He,

so laughter just really does get us outta stress. And when we're in stress, the stress center of the brain, the amygdala. Has not evolved since prehistoric time. It's the fear center and that str, that little amygdala when it fires its goal is to keep us safe. That's it. Just to keep us safe, like saber tooth tiger, as they say, or getting hit by a bus.

It helps us like, oh, you gotta do something. Action required. We are living in a perpetual state of stress now every day. Like more things being piled on, like the price of food, whatever, all the no jobs. You can't buy a house. What all the things lobbed on, like, oh, they're so standing. Okay, let's put heaps some more on there.

So we're living in this state of stress and when we're stressed, we're breathing properly. We're secreting cortisol [00:52:00] and adrenaline and epinephrine, the stress chemicals and our, and so we're in our stress, like we're in our sympathetic nervous system, which is our fight, flight or freeze mode. And when we're in that mode, we're not in rest or digest.

Although people often stress eat, I would say don't do that. If you're angry or stressed, don't eat because it's just going in one end and coming out the other end, and you're not getting the nutrient value of whatever it is you're eating. So we need to go and, you know, do some deep breathing, go for a walk.

We need to just decompress a little bit and then we can eat that food because, our body is not, it can't digest when we're in stress. 

Speaker 3: So I use laughter. Maybe not in the same way you do, but I have noticed that if you really want people to hear what you're saying and understand what you're saying, make them laugh.

Yes. With how you're [00:53:00] saying. So I, it kind of, when I say it, it sometimes sounds like I'm manipulating people, really not. I'm just trying to make sure that if I'm talking somebody, like one person is paying attention and will get, a piece of information that they can use out of it. So, if somebody asks me a question, what happens if I click on my email wrong?

How exactly do you click on your email? Wrong That one, you know? And then they'll go, wait, I can't click on it. Wrong. No. How do you click on it wrong? Are you right clicking on it? Well, you can still open it that way. So it's not exactly wrong. Like what do you mean you're, there's, I don't understand how you could click on it wrong, 

Speaker: but Nikki, where's the, any key 

look

I have Dave, [00:54:00] he helped me through a lot, him and his wife helped me through a lot when I first met them, way back when. I love him to death. He is a great person. Tech is not his friend, just not, he is familiar with it, but he always needs refreshers on how to use it. So he called me once a month or two ago and he was like, can you help me with Zoom?

And I was like, yeah, don't you know how to use Zoom though? You did, use it during 2020, right? He's like, yeah, but I can't remember how to do it. I'm like, okay, that's fine. And so I went with him and went through, taught him how to schedule it, taught him all that good stuff. Not a problem.

Everything's golden. I go out into the other room and I'm kind of stressed, you know, talking to everybody saying, you know, telling them how my day was going and Dave [00:55:00] calls and I'm like, oh, this is gonna be golden. But it didn't come back into my office 'cause it didn't figure it, I'd need to. And I was trying to get something to eat because I was hungry.

And, I answered the phone and he goes, I don't know how to open a scheduled zoom meeting. And I went. Are you sure? He's like, yeah, I just, I can't remember how to do, I don't think I ever did it before. I don't know how to do it. And I went,

you're not gonna laugh. I'm not gonna laugh. I was like, okay. So you know how the zoom window is, right? You know, when you're on that four box window? He's like, yeah, like to the right of that, do you see those events on the right hand side? He's like, yeah. He's like, do you see the blue button that says Start and unhelpfully?

My friend's daughter-in-law starts dying. [00:56:00] She was laughing way too hard because nobody believes me when I say I help people with tech, and some of this stuff is kind of simple. They're like, no, that, no, you obviously help them with bigger stuff. And I literally went, do you see the blue button that says start?

And I said this with a straight face. I almost lost it because Hello It, and he was like, oh, and he made it. He laughed about it because he realized that was, you know, so

soon as I hang up I was like, that was not helpful. And she was like, I realize that's why I covered my face. I'm sorry, but I do not laugh at anybody asking me questions. I really don't. I do, however, with people that I'm comfortable with, like Dave, he knows when he's Sure. Sure. [00:57:00] He is being a little bit extra about something that he really just needed to think for a second and he would've been fine on.

And so he'll catch himself and he'll make a comment that is meant to make us laugh and it's fine. So like, I'm not making fun of anybody. That is not my goal in life. But I do find it funny when I'm trying to tell some, no, I helps people with some very basic tech and she's like, no, you have to do way better for, getting paid.

And I'm like, no, no I don't. And then literally the phone rings and hands a very simple problem that makes her go, okay, nevermind you were hitting. Wow, 

you're right. 

Speaker 3: But I use laughter in those situations because now they're like, oh yeah. Nikki made that comment the last time, so maybe I should pay attention to what I'm looking at before [00:58:00] I'd say something that is right in front of my face.

And so he'll think the next time he schedules something, oh yeah, there's that start button over there that we all laugh about. So it's not to make anybody feel stupid and is not meant in that capacity at all. And if anybody ever said, Hey, I didn't like how, we talked about this or whatever, I would have a genuine conversation with that person and ask them why, you know, what was happening?

You know, where it was coming from, kind of a deal. Because my thing is, if I make you laugh about it, you're gonna remember. Mm. Because you're paying attention. Sure. Oh yeah. Nicki made me laugh by saying this comment, so now I can go do this. So laughter may be the best medicine, but it also, we remember those jokes that really get us going.

Hmm. Right? Like if you go online and you go to these people who are [00:59:00] saying stuff like, the people who are really laughing at them are gonna remember some of those jokes when they go home. Yes. And they're gonna tell their friends those jokes and have them laughing. I'm not a comedian. Never said I was, but I do use sarcasm and, facial expressions to point out that, maybe this isn't as big as you're making it seem Hmm.

Because I know that I can doom spiral with the best of them right. Over nothing. Absolutely. The air today is beautiful, but I'm doom spiraling or whatever. Right. No reason for it. I'm just doing it because. I don't know. Mental health is like that some days, right? 

Speaker 2: Absolutely. 

Speaker 3: And so laughing can take you out of the moment.

So you're taking yourself out of the doom spiral. You're taking yourself out [01:00:00] of thoughts that should not be thought, you're distancing yourself from whatever you think is happening around you so that you can see what is actually happening around you. Because I know not everybody hates me.

You know, like that's not statistically possible, 

Speaker 2: right? 

Speaker 3: I'm not Hitler. Not everybody can hate me. Yeah, they did him and well thought out too, like, I'm not going down that rod, that hole he needed to be hated. No dissenting, but here, but. At the same time, sometimes in our daily lives we take a mustard seed and turn it into a mountain.

Of just the doom spiral and the Oh, but if I say this, they'll think this. And if I do that, they'll do that. And.

Speaker: That's Nelly. [01:01:00] That's Nelly, right? That voice in your head is never your friend. You would never have a friend like the voice in your head. Like they would have to die in the middle of the night ghost, right? That's it. So that's what I've really been mindful of since 2020 is wow, that voice is so powerful and it's always trying to take us down.

And here's what I've kind of surmised about it. The brain's role is to keep us safe and conserve energy. So when we're in a situation we've been in before, like family, you know, Thanksgiving, whatever, and you get in that same spat after a couple of beverages, you know that the brother says something and then you're like, in that same essential liquid, 

Speaker 3: courage in family does not go together.

People. Oh my 

Speaker: right. It does not. But then you get into the thing because the brain's like, oh, there's that comment. I know what to do. So you say your thing, they say their thing and now you're back in the badminton game. Where if you can tell Nelly to just like, shut up for a second, wait a minute, [01:02:00] pause.

The brother's gonna say the thing. Okay, there they go. You can not respond. Just pause for a second, take a breath and respond in a different way and change the trajectory. It's so magic. 

Speaker 3: Or if you're in that situation and you've got, you're watching because now you recognize, you know what brother's gonna say this?

Sister's gonna say this, uncle's gonna say that. You could sit back and just laugh your butt off because nobody else is seeing it. Or maybe there's one other person that is doing the same thing as you, and y'all lock eyes and y'all absolutely lose it. Have you ever done that? Yes. You're in a situation where you know there's a fight happening.

You know you're supposed to be serious. It's just serious. Right. But like you look at the person over there and they are thinking the same thing you're thinking, and you both just absolutely cannot keep it together. You are no longer serious. You can [01:03:00] no longer breathe. 

Speaker 2: Yeah. 

Speaker 3: There are tears. They're snot.

It's just hilarious. Y'all don't even know why exactly. You're laughing as hard as you are, but it's because you both see what is happening. You're watching. Ping pong in real time, but like you're remembering the exact conversation that's about to take place because you have it all the time, right? Yeah.

Take yourself out of it and you step back for a second and you're looking at this family dysfunction. You're just like, oh no, I used to feed into this. That was stupid. Well, now I'm not stupid anymore. Oh, look, my cousin over there, nope, we're done. We're laughing. It's, that's it, 

Speaker: right? And it changes everything.

It just d diffuse and now everybody's yelling 

Speaker 3: at both of you because y'all are, you know, the 10 year olds obviously that can't keep it together in a family discussion, but it is super helpful that you're doing that because eventually somebody's gonna break, [01:04:00] 

Speaker 2: right? Somebody else 

Speaker 3: is gonna break and they're gonna start laughing because now they're like, oh yeah, we were doing this thing again, weren't we?

And then eventually, if you have a sane family, anyway, I've heard. Everybody starts laughing. Yeah. Right? Yeah. Because you're like, oh yeah, wait, you kind of derail the fight. Nobody can fight when there's people laughing at them. Right? Well, they just get madder. Well, there's that, but they're sitting there 'cause who yells at the person laughing.

Right? Right. 

Speaker: When we're in an argument, we're totally in, in our head. We're not in our body anymore. We've left the building and we're just, like emotion, like blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. It's like Charlie Brown's teacher. And we're not. So we're just like, la la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la la and nothing is being accomplished because we're just trying to be right.

We just wanna be, right? Mm-hmm. So if we step back, we start laughing. There's one of the games in, laughter Yoga, which is, argument laughter. [01:05:00] It is a series of little games and the argument laughter, which I suggest to couples when I do, my laughter club often I'll say, if you're with a couple or you're having a fight with somebody, turn it into gibberish laughter argument.

So you're like, wiggling your finger. Maybe you have your hand and you're wiggling Aha. And you're laughing a ha ha and maybe throw some gibberish instead of like,

and then, 

Speaker 3: so there's a 2-year-old in the house, and every once in a while she'll open my door. And she'll go,

I mean, I dunno what you're saying, but I'm gonna yell at you in the same language because I don't care. And she'll stop and she'll look at me for a second, and then she'll either come in and like, talk to me in, a language that is almost English or she'll walk away some days she walks away and she's like, I ain't even, you know, [01:06:00] but it's hilarious to watch somebody's, you know, when you give them back.

Ex I've copied people before, like in the middle of an argument. I wouldn't recommend it unless the person, the person. 

Speaker: Yeah. 

Speaker 3: Because that might like, so be careful. Yeah. Always watch out for yourself in any situation. But, um, it's a, it's a tactic to use when somebody's yelling at you where. Instead of saying words back, you just go back at them with the same intensity.

So if they're going, you don't do that ever again. You go and you will get two responses. If it's a parent yelling at you and you do that, you're gonna get hit. I'm so sorry about your luck. Don't do that. Like I said, be careful. We do not want that to happen. But if it's a friend, a partner, somebody else, you know, where you're on equal footing or [01:07:00] should be, then they're probably gonna be like, wait, what did you just say?

Because they'll think that their anger clouded, whatever you just said. 

Right. And so it knocks them out of the, I'm angry right now and we're only gonna talk at this loudness because you're being dumb because people have arguments. Let's be real. Okay. Be for real. There are a lot of people who get into relationships and they're like, we never fight.

Hmm. Oh yeah. Are you still going to your mom's house to park?

Because Yeah, I'm gonna tell you that if you are in insane relationship, if you are actually together, if you are actually fighting for each other, you are going to fight with each other sometimes. Yeah. Because one of you is gonna think that option A is the best answer and the other of you is gonna think that option B is the right answer.

And I [01:08:00] don't care how much therapy you're in, and everybody's like, you just have to communicate. Just say softly that you are thinking stupid and you should believe in option A. Somebody's gonna get an attitude. Okay. I could tell you that I have an attitude. I am Italian and Spanish, and a whole bunch of Heinz 57.

Okay. I have the two. Not a problem with it. I don't care. Let's go. But I also know that I have to watch my mouth sometimes because I will say something because of how I was trained to fight. Mm. By, watching people as I was growing up. Yeah. That you throw those jabs to hurt people. Yeah. And like, we don't wanna do that.

That is hurt. People, hurting people or Yeah. Narcissists are in the room. We don't like them. We don't want to fight with them. Shut that down. But if you get into an argument with your [01:09:00] whoever, and you have them step out of that argument for a second, then they're gonna be like, wait a minute. Okay.

So let's see. Why do you think A, why do I think B? Let's like break it down. But if you talk to a friend and they're like, we never argue. We love each other just so much. Go puke for them because that's not a real relationship and you can go get sick. I guarantee you nobody will. Well, once she breaks up with them, nobody will care.

Because if you're not fighting with each other even a little bit, and I'm not saying knock down drag out fights. No. I'm saying a little bit of an argument here or there. Yeah. Disagreements then. Then you're not in a relationship where anybody's going to be in it for very long because you're not fighting for each other with each other.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. You're not growing, you're just staying stagnant. Yeah. You're just staying safe. Yeah. Yeah. [01:10:00] Yeah. I mean, there is the honeymoon 

Speaker 3: period right after a wedding or whatever. But you still, if you're going months, years without arguing, there's a problem in your relationship that you need to look at.

And so I talk a lot about mental health on here. Mm-hmm. And we've talked about it some today. The big thing for me is mental health isn't just saying, oh, I have PTSD because my mom was a narcissist. 

Speaker 2: Hmm. 

Speaker 3: Actually that's the C-P-T-S-D, not the PTSD, my bad. But, there's a difference on that one.

But it is also in how we argue with people is how we talk to people. So I find myself, if I get irritated. And I get angry because lemme tell you, as an Italian spanning Spaniard with Heinz 57 happening, there's a lot of anger that comes out every once in a while, [01:11:00] especially because of all that trauma.

I have to watch myself because I know, because of the way I grew up and the fighting I saw as I was growing up that, fights can get real painful. Mm-hmm. You can say some things to your partner, your friend, whoever, and you are purposely trying to hurt them because that's what you know, we should not be doing that.

That is not okay. We need to work on that. I work on it. It's a work in progress. Trust me, if I snap at you, I'll be okay in a minute. It's real fleeting. Okay. But I try to make sure that I watch my words. Because as much as words have hurt me and actions and whole lots of other stuff, then you know, I know that my words and actions can hurt other people, even if I'm not trying.

Speaker 2: Yeah. [01:12:00] 

Speaker 3: So even if I'm trying to make somebody laugh to get the point of something, it is never from the case of, oh, I'm smarter than you. Right. No, I know this information because I'm an idiot. This is the one thing I'm good at is picking up information from new software. It's my thing, right? I can go into software, I can learn it.

It's great. At the same time, I know that other people's main thing is they can go talk to people and not have a problem with it. Mm-hmm. Where my anxiety is about to shoot off the wall if I have to talk to somebody I've never talked to before. 

Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. Yeah. 

Speaker 3: So everybody has strengths and weaknesses.

Absolutely. Every relationship has strengths and weaknesses. If you don't think that your relationship has strengths and weaknesses, I'm sorry, but I don't think it's gonna last. 

Speaker: Hmm. Yeah. Yeah. It's fascinating. Yeah, because we get it, we do get in our head and then we wanna be Right. And when we're in a, an argument as said, [01:13:00] we're just in our head and we're not even present anymore.

Speaker 3: You're not a person anymore. That's it. 'cause I'm fighting you. It is based solely on the fact that a, I got pissed off because of something you said. Did. Today is Monday. I don't know. Whatever. Right? Yeah. And so now I'm mad and you're yelling at me. So now old way of thinking, anyway, I have to best you, I have to beat you at the game you came at me with, which means I'm gonna hurt you.

Not that I intentionally go, I'm gonna hurt you. 'cause that's not how I fight. But it's a, a learned response to that kind of a situation. 

Speaker: That's it. Our frontal lobe disconnects our thinking, brain disconnects, and we go into our reptilian brain. Mm-hmm. So we're just responding rather than reacting or No, we're reacting.

That's it. [01:14:00] We're reacting instead of like pausing and going. Okay. Because words matter. That's the thing. I mean, I think of days of old fighting was fine and you got it out and whatever, but now it's like. We're aware, we know that when we say it, it's out. We can't put it back in. 

Words matter.

They really matter. And they hurt. If you are trying to, 

Speaker 3: we as a people, we understand that bullying is bad because words hurt. Yeah. You know, that whole sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me. That was the biggest lie we taught ourselves. Or somebody taught somebody. Yeah.

Right. We were lied to because words hurt way more than sticks and stones. 

Speaker: Right. Yeah. You're gonna heal from that bruise. But the words, yeah, that's it. 

Speaker 3: Yeah. But those hurtful words, they become your inner dialogue. And then the next time you're trying to do something new, you put up those same roadblocks.

Because remember, [01:15:00] somebody called you stupid for doing that. Hmm. Fastest way to close me down tighter than Fort Knox is to tell me I'm stupid or imply it with words. Right. Because you can imply that somebody's three crackers short of a stack, you know? Absolutely. Or, so to sum up the arguing thing, when you're arguing, if it gets to a point where you're yelling at each other, neither of you are actually fighting each other, you're fighting old responses.

Speaker 2: Hmm. 

Speaker 3: Take a step back, breathe for a second. Maybe separate. I know that I tried to, and some of my relations separate, the relationships separate so that I could calm down because I know I can go from zero to real mean real quick in those situations, and not being allowed to do that just made the situation less longer and get louder.

Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. Yeah. [01:16:00] 

Speaker 3: Yeah. And worse in other ways. So, you know, take a step back, even if it's a 10 minute break. Okay. You go breathe. I'm gonna go breathe. We'll come back to this in a minute. Yeah. And we'll like work together on something instead of against each other.

That's it. You don't wanna be working against your partner. That's like the stupidest thing to do. 'cause that means your relationship's heading for the dumpster. 

Speaker 2: That's it. Yeah. 

Speaker 3: You wanna remember your old habits as you're fighting so that you don't go for the kill shot on somebody you're supposed to love.

Speaker: Yeah. 

Speaker 3: That's unnecessary damage. Just unnecessary and

laughing in the middle of an argument. Depending on who you're with, may or may not help to settle things down so that you can separate without somebody going. But no, I'm still mad. Get [01:17:00] back here. Mm. Yeah. 'cause like I said, there have been people in my past that if I'd have laughed in the middle of an argument,

Speaker: it might affect you.

Speaker 3: It might have been painful. 

Speaker: Yeah. 

Speaker 3: Yeah. But on the other side of things, I think it was Mike Tyson could be wrong on who said it, but the quote is that people today are real, used to not getting punched in the face for the things that they've said. Because you can go online nowadays and people will be saying this wildest of thing.

And so what I want you to do is think before you speak. Would this have gotten me hit if I was still in school? And if the answer is yes, maybe don't say it. Maybe don't type it. 

Speaker: That's it. 

Speaker 3: Maybe stop putting bad stuff into the air and you'll get good stuff in return. And I don't mean that in the [01:18:00] woo woo sense.

'cause a lot of people don't like woowoo, including me. I'm not a woowoo person. But when you stop fighting a battle that's been over for years, you tend to be able to walk out the other side a little bit better. 

Speaker 4: Yeah. 

Speaker: I've really learned since 2020 that we really need to manage our nervous system. So simple but not easy.

Speaker 3: Is that what they say? It's simple to say. It's simple to say. Not so simple to do. Not 

Speaker: so simple to do. Especially when we're in it, when we're in that stressful situation, whatever it is, check or money or whatever it is that's happening, it's easy to say, oh, just get over it. That's the kind of the worst thing to say to somebody.

Oh, just relax. Oh, stop. Put 'em up. Relax. I'm in the midst of something. 

Speaker 3: Telling me to calm down. Calm down. Angry is probably the [01:19:00] best chance of me actually getting violent there ever was. Not that I have. 

Speaker 2: Yeah. 

Speaker 3: That's not what I'm saying, but the chances go way up if you're telling me to calm down. 

Speaker: Right?

That's not the, that's not what to do. But, that's where the laughter comes in. It really does diffuse the situation. Like, why do we laugh? When it's uncomfortable? Why do we laugh when it's not, appropriate. Like at a funeral. Why? Why would we laugh there? Because we're so stressed.

It's like the pressure cooker. It's the body's response to too much stress. So we laugh as a release and it changes everything. It changes our state. We get oxygenated and we're secreting dopamine, oxytocin, serotonin, and endorphins. The love drugs. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So beautiful. 

Well, I just want to invite, I alluded to it earlier in the chat. I [01:20:00] really wanted to, invite you and your listeners to come and check out my Laughter Club. It's free, it's online. Every Tuesday, 9:30 AM Eastern Time, 30 minutes of super fun self-care. I incorporate tapping Brain Gym, Qigong. I really just wanna help people get out of stress and into joy because when we feel good, we do good.

Speaker 3: Okay. If you gimme the link, I'll make sure that, or if you've already given me the link, I'll make sure that's in the description below. 

Speaker: Love it. Yeah. The website is kathy's club.com. Kathy with a C. Oh, Nikki. Thank you. I've really enjoyed our conversation today.